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-   -   I had boss battles (http://www.ritualistic.com/forums/showthread.php?t=17496)

fgauswob 05-13-2006 07:54 PM

I had boss battles
 
Well I just finished and ya is O.K. but why would you do boss battles you got a got story going for you. I think boss battles suck totally pointless. You try to shoot something for who now's how long. Games with a good story don't need boss battles, sad truth so there are only a few FPS with a good story who don't fill or make up the lag with boss battles. Overall was fun to play up until the Heli at the END. Skill 73.11

Lord_Rick 05-13-2006 08:07 PM

Re: I had boss battles
 
Emergence has tried to remain true to the original game in more ways than one. Boss fights are simply one of these elements. Personally i salute them for it, i miss the old days of FPS games with boss fights and people exploding when you shoot them [img]/forums/images/graemlins/smirk.gif[/img]

CrimsonDeathBed 05-13-2006 09:36 PM

Re: I had boss battles
 
hell, even doom 3 has boss battles...

MathiasBelch 05-14-2006 02:00 AM

Re: I had boss battles
 
And DooM 3 kind of sucked, too. And boss battles were fundemental to every other FPS when the first SiN came out. Time to move on.

Smoke39 05-14-2006 02:02 AM

Re: I had boss battles
 
Just because boss battles aren't trendy anymore in FPSs doesn't mean they're an inherently bad idea.

MathiasBelch 05-14-2006 02:18 AM

Re: I had boss battles
 
Yes, but in this game, which is average at best, they can up with something better. They need to come up with something better.

CommanderZx2 05-14-2006 02:38 AM

Re: I had boss battles
 
I'm glad none of you are game developers [img]/forums/images/graemlins/laugh.gif[/img]

Smoke39 05-14-2006 05:23 AM

Re: I had boss battles
 
I'm actually going to college to become a game developer. You're making me cry. :<

nba1341 05-14-2006 06:24 AM

Re: I had boss battles
 
boss battles are awsome

and in sin episodes, well ive only been to the first boss but its not like the guy has a health bar and something comes up on your screen that says his name and what not like a house of the dead type of thing


WretchedSpawn 05-14-2006 07:03 AM

Re: I had boss battles
 
Quote:

Originally posted by fgauswob:
Well I just finished and ya is O.K. but why would you do boss battles you got a got story going for you. I think boss battles suck totally pointless. You try to shoot something for who now's how long. Games with a good story don't need boss battles, sad truth so there are only a few FPS with a good story who don't fill or make up the lag with boss battles. Overall was fun to play up until the Heli at the END. Skill 73.11

Wait a minute, so according to you just how many non tactical (Rainbow 6 and Ghost Recon type stuff, removed from contension because they don't have any room for bosses), and non historical-war-based (Medal of Honor, Vietcong, etc. for same reason mentioned before) first-person-shooters with a "good story" (a.k.a there aren't any bosses) are currently in existence?

I count duck hunt... does that count as first-person? I mean I guess it is though I always felt like I was more of a spectator to the slaughter instead of really being in the game. Thief 2 didn't have any bosses did it? Well I guess it wasn't really a FPS since the 'S' in FPS was only used to put out candles... I've got maybe one. What am I missing here?

Oh snap! I got it! Halo. Halo is now the greatest FPS ever made by virtue of not being remotely realistic, not being based on a historical war, and not having anything you could really call a boss battle! All bow before the mighty Halo...

One thing I never understood were the boss battles in the Metal Gear Solid games. I mean, the point of the game is stealth and yet there's still gung-ho, ballz-out, gunz-blazin, heat-seaking-missiles-a-firing boss battles. It just doesn't make sense to me and seems so incrediby out of place... Really ruined the mood. "Oh, you're sneakin, you're sneakin, quiet now, watch out! that enemy almost saw you dude!, you're sneakin, OK NOW YOURE WIPPING OUT THE MACHINE GUN AND PUMPING HIM FULL OF CLIP AFTER CLIP OF AMMO WHITE KNUCKLES GRIPPING THE CONTROLLER AS YOU WATCH YOUR HEALTH BAR FALLING... you're sneakin, you're sneakin, OH SHIT! YOU JUST SNEEZED RIGHT BY THAT COLUMN OF MARINES AND THEY ALL TURNED AROUND AND SAW YOU!!! Game Over buster. Time to restart!"

KalZakath 05-14-2006 08:12 AM

Re: I had boss battles
 
Quote:

Originally posted by WretchedSpawn:
Oh snap! I got it! Halo. Halo is now the greatest FPS ever made by virtue of not being remotely realistic, not being based on a historical war, and not having anything you could really call a boss battle! All bow before the mighty Halo...

Had a chuckle at that [img]/forums/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img] I generally don't like FPS on console anyway, but I played about 10 mins of Halo and couldn't ever go back there [img]/forums/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img] I never understood why it was the XB 'killer game' - I guess those poor sods that only play console don't understand what the rest of us have been playing for all these years [img]/forums/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img] I thought Timesplitters 2 was an OK example of FPS on gamecube - but I'm biased because I used to love GoldenEye on N64 too [img]/forums/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img]

Quote:

Originally posted by WretchedSpawn:
One thing I never understood were the boss battles in the Metal Gear Solid games.

Bah, Hideo Kojima has lost it IMO [img]/forums/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img] MGS1 was OK in the PS1 days - playable, but nothing special. Doubling back over most of the map in particular let it down, hate that. Played MGS3:Subsistence recently on PS2. "Pffft" [img]/forums/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img] Again, mainly 'stealth' - creeping around, shooting soldiers with an annoying tranq gun, lying in the grass sometimes for 120 secs+ waiting for several timers to run out. Take 12 costumes and 12 facepaints into the field, wear 3 of each the entire game because they're just better stat-wise. And topped off with "wait for boss to stop at point 1,2 or 3, shoot boss once only (more shots no damage), wait for boss to stop at point 1,2 or 3, boss gets more annoyed...". To think of the hours they wasted making that game [img]/forums/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img]

I didn't mind the boss battles in Emergence too much, but like most they are pretty empty experiences, and the only feeling I had after beating the guy with the shockwave attack was one of disgust at the amount of ammo it took, and the lack of replacements immediately available [img]/forums/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img] I found some pickups in the corner but nothing that made up for the onslaught I had to deliver [img]/forums/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img]

Boss battles certainly can add to a game, but it's difficult to get a balance that everyone will be happy with, as with a lot of things. You want to keep the action rolling and give an experience that's fun, exhilirating, achievable, and worthwhile - it's a tall order [img]/forums/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img]

he_the_great 05-14-2006 10:36 PM

Re: I had boss battles
 
Quote:

Originally posted by KalZakath:
Had a chuckle at that [img]/forums/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img] I generally don't like FPS on console anyway, but I played about 10 mins of Halo and couldn't ever go back there [img]/forums/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img] I never understood why it was the XB 'killer game' - I guess those poor sods that only play console don't understand what the rest of us have been playing for all these years [img]/forums/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img] I thought Timesplitters 2 was an OK example of FPS on gamecube - but I'm biased because I used to love GoldenEye on N64 too [img]/forums/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img]

umm, 10 minutes and you can't see why it was a good game. Yeah I would agree the first ten minutes of the game does not make it good. I will agree that consoles do not make good FPS systems, in fact they aren't really good for anything except RPG and sidescrollers. Of course I'm bias because I have a mouse. [img]/forums/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img] Anyway, after playing Halo for two hours on the Xbox I had to buy it for PC so I could finish it.

Moleculor 05-14-2006 11:51 PM

Re: I had boss battles
 
Keep in mind that I haven't beaten this game yet, but I partially agree with the original poster. I've beaten the rhino-mutant, and that was mildly 'meh' to me.

Sidestep and blast the entire time. Same target the whole time, etc. While I prefer bosses to no bosses, I'd also prefer something that isn't just a raging single beast that I have to fill full of lead. Maybe something with target points or multiple parts or multiple whatever. *shrug* Still, I'd prefer the raging rhino-beast over nothing at all.

KalZakath 05-15-2006 05:54 AM

Re: I had boss battles
 
Quote:

Originally posted by he_the_great:
umm, 10 minutes and you can't see why it was a good game. Yeah I would agree the first ten minutes of the game does not make it good.

I also watched a friend play a couple of full sections of the game, and tried (even more briefly [img]/forums/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img]) the PC demo. Maybe it was because I'd been playing PC FPS for years, but Halo really didn't impress me at all. Rubbish weapons, strange feel to the controls, annoying voice acting. I was surprised they brought it to the PC, although that would have been driven by the low XB hardware sales. As a console FPS it's OK (just), but I still thought TS2/Gamecube was more enjoyable [img]/forums/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img] (Darn wooden AI tho).

After TS2/Gamecube and N64/GoldenEye (possibly the best console FPS for some time - 4 player was a blast), the only other console FPS I genuinely enjoyed was Quake 3 on the Dreamcast - with the mouse and keyboard, surprise surprise [img]/forums/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img]

Smoke39 05-15-2006 06:07 AM

Re: I had boss battles
 
Quote:

Originally posted by Moleculor:
Sidestep and blast the entire time. Same target the whole time, etc. While I prefer bosses to no bosses, I'd also prefer something that isn't just a raging single beast that I have to fill full of lead. Maybe something with target points or multiple parts or multiple whatever. *shrug* Still, I'd prefer the raging rhino-beast over nothing at all.

I agree. Bosses can be cool, but they really need to have an interesting design in order to add much to the game.

ATimson 05-15-2006 10:10 AM

Re: I had boss battles
 
Quote:

Originally posted by KalZakath:
I was surprised they brought it to the PC, although that would have been driven by the low XB hardware sales.

Doubt it. It was more likely driven by the promises that yes, it will be coming out on Xbox first, but it'll still be coming out on PC like it was originally being developed for.

KalZakath 05-15-2006 10:37 AM

Re: I had boss battles
 
Quote:

Originally posted by ATimson:
Doubt it. It was more likely driven by the promises that yes, it will be coming out on Xbox first, but it'll still be coming out on PC like it was originally being developed for.

Debatable [img]/forums/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img] Halo was always intended as an exclusive XBox title, by both Bungie and Microsoft. It cost a huge amount to make - MS happily footed the bill, something they did with several developers in a similar situation (exclusive titles). It launched for XBox - both companies realised they would struggle to even things up, given the expensive development budget. Before it was released, all we heard was "exclusive, exclusive, exclusive" - oh look, out it pops on PC [img]/forums/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img] MS doesn't turn decisions around without reason, especially if it means people can point out they screwed up - coupled with the losses made on every XB ever sold, I'm sure the relatively low sales forced them to release on PC. It makes little sense for MS to bang on about exclusivity for months and months, only to release for PC afterwards. Money is involved, but not in a good way [img]/forums/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img] Rather than "hey we can release on PC too and make loads" (which was obvious to everyone really), I think it was more like "this is gonna have go on PC too, hit something with a bigger playerbase" [img]/forums/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img]

Hopefully Bungie will keep future Halos where they belong, on the thing with the green logo [img]/forums/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img]

ATimson 05-15-2006 11:05 AM

Re: I had boss battles
 
Quote:

Originally posted by KalZakath:
Debatable [img]/forums/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img] Halo was always intended as an exclusive XBox title, by both Bungie and Microsoft.

Not "always", no. Back in 1999/2000, it was being developed for Mac and PC. Late 2000 was when they made the jump to Xbox, but even before release they were saying there'd still be PC/Mac versions (very last question).

Quote:

Hopefully Bungie will keep future Halos where they belong, on the thing with the green logo [img]/forums/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img]

Doubt it. Halo 2 is being ported to PC, and I certainly hope that Halo 3 is so that they don't leave us with a giant cliffhanger!

badman 05-15-2006 11:30 AM

Re: I had boss battles
 
Quote:

Originally posted by KalZakath:
MS doesn't turn decisions around without reason, especially if it means people can point out they screwed up - coupled with the losses made on every XB ever sold, I'm sure the relatively low sales forced them to release on PC.

Halo is one of the best-selling video game franchises ever. The first game was in the top 10 best selling video games charts for years after its release.

Quote:

It makes little sense for MS to bang on about exclusivity for months and months, only to release for PC afterwards. Money is involved, but not in a good way [img]/forums/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img] Rather than "hey we can release on PC too and make loads" (which was obvious to everyone really), I think it was more like "this is gonna have go on PC too, hit something with a bigger playerbase" [img]/forums/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img]

It's called marketing. Both Halos are what they call 'system sellers' - games that people will buy consoles for. It was in Microsoft's best interest to tout Halo's exclusivity at every turn, as it helped drive hardware sales. The GTA series is another example of this - exclusively (at least for a time) on PS2, those games resulted in loads and loads of PS2 sales.

Related, I can assure you that the player base on the PC can't even get near that of Xbox. The PC is a niche, and yes, while there are some games that do extremely well on it (Blizzard comes to mind here), most don't.

KalZakath 05-15-2006 03:20 PM

Re: I had boss battles
 
Darn, I have been pwned from several angles, and exposed as a Halo hater [img]/forums/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img] chuckle

*shuts up* [img]/forums/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img]

bloodraven43 05-15-2006 09:51 PM

Re: I had boss battles
 
no boss battles? thats like having a grill cheese without the bread.those boss battles were awesome and the finale....omg!!!!! was that intense...i loved it. [img]/forums/images/graemlins/cool.gif[/img]

PunchPudding 05-16-2006 12:23 AM

Re: I had boss battles
 
I thought the 'boss' battles were pretty fun, I mean, variety is always good. At least they were part of the story since those 'bosses' seem to be major part of the next episode.

ATimson 05-16-2006 12:30 AM

Re: I had boss battles
 
Quote:

Originally posted by PunchPudding:
I thought the 'boss' battles were pretty fun, I mean, variety is always good. At least they were part of the story since those 'bosses' seem to be major part of the next episode.

They do, but JC's description made them sound a lot nastier than they felt at the time....

David_Grove 05-20-2006 09:32 PM

Re: I had boss battles
 
Okay, first off, I thought that the beast had to be brought out just to show the kind of devistation it could cause, plowing through stuff like there was no tomorrow along with the fact of what it could do to you. In later games I see this as being a formitable enemy.

Now, for the Halo topic; Why do people enjoy that game so much? I beat Halo 1 and played through most of Halo 2. Both are pretty standard shooters, most of the time the graphics kinda blurr together since the bloom is up pretty high in attempts to mask the fact that their graphics are still somewhat sub-par. Bloom can make ANYTHING look a bit nicer. Try putting it up on Jedi Academy. Same graphics, just a lit more light. It also had very little in the way of unpredictability. Enemies were easily taken down. In all honesty, if a fanboy were to step back and REALLY take a look at it, take an honest look, they'd see it doesn't offer many new things if anything. Dual wielding? Play Unreal Tornament. The vehicles aren't much to speak of, nor is the ally AI seeing as they're stupid enough to walk into a grenade laying in the ground. Multiplayer I hear is what makes Halo, but honestly, its still pretty much the same feeling. Global Operations gave me more of a kick in terms of multiplayer and it has serious issues to work out!

Shoelip 05-20-2006 10:13 PM

Re: I had boss battles
 
I don't get why people think Halo is the best thing since sliced lettuce either, but it is a really good game. I think it might have something to do with the Covenent being pretty cool as an enemy and the soundtrack being really catchy. The story is pretty cool too. I'm torn between liking it and hating it though. On the one hand it's a very good game, but on the other hand it's just another way for Microsoft to make even more money and it's the reason Bungie got taken over by MS, thus destroying the Myth franchise and any hope for Oni. I suppose though that the blame for that should be put on Bungie and Microsoft, Bungie for totally selling out, and Microsoft for being evil greedy bastards.

Wow, I usually notice when I go completely off topic. Erm, well the boss was annoying at first but once I figured out I could dodge it it ended up being cool.


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