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Old 05-17-2006, 01:08 PM   #26
TheDarthJedi
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Default Re: Not worth to buy ?

i want to know how he beat the game in 3 hours with the sliders all the way to the right.......


i have a hard time believing thats really possible.

heh
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Old 05-17-2006, 01:49 PM   #27
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Default Re: Not worth to buy ?

good god how many '$20 dollars was too much" threads are there going to be? Im sick of hearing it. I appreciate the fact that everyone has an opinion on the issue and i have no problem with that. What i do have a problem with is seeing the same thread occuring over and over again. Please, if you think $20 is too much, dont buy the rest of the episodes, and keep it to yourself.
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Old 05-17-2006, 01:52 PM   #28
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Default Re: Not worth to buy ?

What were you expecting? Anything new comes with controversy.
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Old 05-17-2006, 01:57 PM   #29
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Default Re: Not worth to buy ?

Some of you seem to be discussing Emergence almost as if it were a fire-and-forget one-off title. You need to remember that one of the biggest advantages to this whole Episodic thing, and one of the aspects thats been hyped the most, is the fact that each "Episode" should be better than the ones that came before it because Ritual will be responding to criticism and trying to iron out all of the "wrinkles" as it were (just look at the episodic Bone adventure games for an example of this phenomenon). Ritual has even been talking about altering their planned storylines in response to user feedback.

I don't see Episode 1 as a flawed product that will turn me off from Sin forever after. I see it as a promising beginning and an investment. The Sin Episodes are something that will hopefully improve exponentially with each new release. Based on how much feedback they've been getting in the past week and provided that they address at least the top 5 biggest complaints that people have been having, I don't see how there's any chance that Episode 2 won't be leaps and bounds better than Episode 1. And then the cycle repeats and Episode 3 will be leaps and bounds better than 2 and on and on. Hopefully many of the changes that they end up implementing, things like new controls or AI, will also be applied to the previous Episodes so they will also be improving in quality, and therefore "value", the longer you own them.

You're not just paying for a game. You're paying for a whole experience, the 9 Episode story arc, that will essentially be "custom-tailored" to the tastes and preferences of you and your peers. As long as I see my money getting put to good use, I'll be perfectley happy [img]/forums/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img]
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Old 05-17-2006, 02:34 PM   #30
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Default Re: Not worth to buy ?

Quote:
Originally posted by WretchedSpawn:
Some of you seem to be discussing Emergence almost as if it were a fire-and-forget one-off title. *snip*
What an excellent post [img]/forums/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img] A shame though, that the people who should be reading it will get bored after the first paragraph, and through no fault of your own. To be honest, I'm wondering if "the masses" will ever understand the aim of Episodic gaming enough to accept it. I'm imagining comments like "lolz, they improve games already, it's called patching". It could be one of the biggest and most important things to hit the gaming industry for years - it's a big idea to swallow, when most devs/publishers will continue with their chosen way of doing things. They have the fear, and hopefully Ritual can teach them a thing or two.

If only people like EA would:

(a) Get on the bandwagon and produce genuine, worthwhile episodic content
-or-
(b) Close their doors, stop making 'games', and do us all a favour [img]/forums/images/graemlins/laugh.gif[/img]

Ahem...
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Old 05-17-2006, 03:05 PM   #31
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Default Re: Not worth to buy ?

Quote:
Originally posted by KalZakath:
What an excellent post [img]/forums/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img] A shame though, that the people who should be reading it will get bored after the first paragraph, and through no fault of your own. To be honest, I'm wondering if "the masses" will ever understand the aim of Episodic gaming enough to accept it. I'm imagining comments like "lolz, they improve games already, it's called patching". It could be one of the biggest and most important things to hit the gaming industry for years - it's a big idea to swallow, when most devs/publishers will continue with their chosen way of doing things. They have the fear, and hopefully Ritual can teach them a thing or two.

If only people like EA would:

(a) Get on the bandwagon and produce genuine, worthwhile episodic content
-or-
(b) Close their doors, stop making 'games', and do us all a favour [img]/forums/images/graemlins/laugh.gif[/img]

Ahem...
Episodic content has great possibility in that fans/players comments and concerns are heard and implemented much quicker because there isn't a span of years between games, that doesn't mean everything about Rituals current model is perfect.
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Old 05-17-2006, 03:08 PM   #32
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Quote:
Originally posted by KalZakath:
If only people like EA would:

(a) Get on the bandwagon and produce genuine, worthwhile content
-or-
(b) Close their doors, stop making 'games', and do us all a favour [img]/forums/images/graemlins/laugh.gif[/img]

Ahem...
Corrected A but I'll still go with B.
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Old 05-17-2006, 03:39 PM   #33
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Default Re: Not worth to buy ?

Quote:
Originally posted by Gabbo:
Episodic content has great possibility in that fans/players comments and concerns are heard and implemented much quicker because there isn't a span of years between games, that doesn't mean everything about Rituals current model is perfect.
We know our current model isn't perfect, but by the time we get the next couple of episodes out, it will be. (grin)
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Old 05-17-2006, 03:50 PM   #34
KalZakath
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Default Re: Not worth to buy ?

Quote:
Originally posted by Standoff:
Quote:
Originally posted by KalZakath:
If only people like EA would:

(a) Get on the bandwagon and produce genuine, worthwhile content
-or-
(b) Close their doors, stop making 'games', and do us all a favour [img]/forums/images/graemlins/laugh.gif[/img]

Ahem...
Corrected A but I'll still go with B.
Correction noted and appreciated [img]/forums/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img]
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Old 05-17-2006, 06:41 PM   #35
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Default Re: Not worth to buy ?

Quote:
Most FPSes I've played in the last three years only gave me about 8 to 12 hours of gameplay...the one that actually told me how long I'd been playing was about 7.5 (and I'm on the last level.)
Sin 1 can be finished in under six hours at normal pacing once you know the maps. And that IS a "full game" as it were!
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Old 05-17-2006, 11:25 PM   #36
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Default Re: Not worth to buy ?

I thought the game was fun and 20 dollars seemed about right to me.

First off a few things to think about:

I get sorta pissed off when I hear folks whine about the price...simply don't buy it then. Enough said. I just think in my own mind of some of my less scrupulous friends who download every game under the sun for free then pay for 1 and bitch about it being expensive....just gets under my skin.

Second,

The content is episodic, it will give the developers freedom to evolve the story line that in itself to me is worth signing on for, judging the series at this time is sorta like judging a 900 page novel based on the prologue.

Third,

The PC game industry has been getting "ripped off" by the gaming public and distribution companies for a very very long time, a market adjustment has been needed for a very long time.

Forth,

No AI WILL EVER BE ON PAR WITH A HUMAN OPPONENT!! The AI cannot be more aware of it's surroundings then the gamer, it's impossible, it can only be faster and more precise, at the moment it isn't really able to "anticipate" your actions.


In summation,
The game was a good opening segue into a branching story line. A bit on the pricey side but not far enough off that'd I'd complain, although about an hour more gameplay probably would ease that up completely.

Things I think can be improved.

1. AI was exceedingly stupid at times..I have to admit walking up to them and shooting them after standing next to them for around 3 or 4 seconds was a bit....silly.

2. Need to put average expected gameplay with each episode. Gives some idea of how much content to expect and would be appreciated.

3. You need to come out with episodes about every 2 mos max. People are going to forget this game in 6 mos, content needs to available so people stay interested.

4. On the same note as above a release timeline for new episodes. If the studio can't release content on time well you don't need to be in business...besides episodes 2 -4 should be "mostly cooked" and on the shelf already.

THE ABOVE IS OPINION PLEASE TREAT AS SUCH!







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Old 05-17-2006, 11:45 PM   #37
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Default Re: Not worth to buy ?

Quote:
Originally posted by Xale:
...besides episodes 2 -4 should be "mostly cooked" and on the shelf already.
You think a small independent studio that is self funding the project can do this?
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Old 05-18-2006, 07:56 PM   #38
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Default Re: Not worth to buy ?

They should have venture capital backing or a bank loan or 12 just for payroll. If you are paying folks, have them work a full day, barring any major changes to the engine, yes, they should have a setting and some artwork done for that setting, an idea of what weapons will be used and some modeling done, and a story line or at least a rough story board. It probably doesn't have any real detail applied because it's the details that eat tons of time but a rough sketch..they should defintely have that, I mean they have 7 episodes proposed...they didn't just pick that number out of a hat...I hope.

It would be hard to "self-fund" a project of this magnitude, and to get finicial backing you need a business plan of some sort, those items would go along way to securing further financing...not as far as a good profit margin...but those kind of things show..

1. Belief in the concept you are trying to sell.

2. Commitment to a development schedule.

3. Solid management pracitices.

Those are 3 things at minimum a group or bank would need to see in order to even consider backing a project.
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Old 05-18-2006, 08:09 PM   #39
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Default Re: Not worth to buy ?

You forgot;

4. Willingness to compromise artistic vision for a few extra sales.

That's the most important thing to modern publishers.
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Old 05-19-2006, 12:36 AM   #40
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When he said, "on the shelf already" , I thought he meant finished and on store shelves. Silly me.
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Old 05-19-2006, 10:17 AM   #41
Xale
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Quote:
Originally posted by Shoelip:
You forgot;

4. Willingness to compromise artistic vision for a few extra sales.

That's the most important thing to modern publishers.
Sad but true, but hopefully between Steam and episodic content, the studio will retain some rights..and I dunno...maybe acually reap some of the rewards of their collective work. We can only hope.
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Old 05-19-2006, 01:03 PM   #42
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Default Re: Not worth to buy ?

When i bought this game i knew it's going to be episodic and i don't think the price was too high, at least for me it wasn't. And i think it was worth of every cent's. People seem to forget that it had Sin1 with SP and MP, and maybe future episodes will be a bit longer than this one, don't forget about upcoming MP and arena, if they are not going to extra charge about those, like they could, then it's more than a fair price per episode. Bw, i didn't play at hardest and it took me about 6 hours, mostly because i was seeking secrets, to finish it.
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Old 05-19-2006, 01:46 PM   #43
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Well Personally I enjoyed sin episodes: emergence, however now that I think about it, I think they could have done a release schedule simliar to hl2

first release a sequel using the source engine something like Sin 2 but not necessarily titled as such. It could be something like Sin: Emergence

and then continue up the story in episodic content such as Sin Episodes: whatever the next name is.

This is to give players an initial game that everyone can play and it feels like a full game. The episodic content should be more of an add-on to the sequel game. It's like purchasing a full novel a chapter at a time. It may seem like a great idea at the time, but frustrating in the end because in the end it feels like a comic strip or a tv series. I would rather prefer seeing the movie in its entirety and then later see a continuation of the movie in a tv series like manner. Although it could be seen that the original sin was the main game and that the episodic content continues from then, the length of time since the original release makes it difficult to really remember the main game and it can be a barrier to newcomers as most people aren't too interested in playing the original. So i believe that making a full sequel game first with episodic content afterwards would be much better.
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Old 05-19-2006, 02:03 PM   #44
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Default Re: Not worth to buy ?

If anyone thinks the AI is good in this game I laugh. EVERYONE try this: Start or load a SiN:E game, grab an object like a trash can (enough to cover your face) and walk around. Make sure to always be looking at the enemy (you cant see because of your object your holding) and the enemy will NEVER see you. I just walk around holding an object, when I see an enemy (or know where they are) I drop the object, shoot in the head, pick the object up and continue. Works for a uber shield as well.

The AI is probably one of the worst AIís Iíve ever seen. I can also shoot the guys if I am far away or around a corner or under a car and they donít even move or do anything about it. I can kill them how ever and how fast I want to.

Once you beat the game the first time I can run through it in little over an hour. For $20!!! I do not agree with a them trying to make a $20 game off a $10 game. Thatís right, the first episode was worth $10 in my eyes. The game is not ALL bad donít get me wrong, the thing I thought was the MOST innovative were the health stations and canisters you can put in them. Yea of course the jetpacks were cool but I never thought to myself, ďI want one of thoseĒ.

I havenít played Sin:E1 in about a week now, got old and got old quick. Best of luck to Ritual on the next episodes, I think your going to need it.
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Old 05-19-2006, 06:24 PM   #45
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Default Re: Not worth to buy ?

Well, to be honest, you are right about AI, then again, i haven't seen superblasting AI on any other games either. But, if AI would be a godlike, then ppl start complaining about too good AI and it would be totally unplayable to most casual players, actually i don't think there ever will be a game that every single human been loves, it's just impossible to do it.
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Old 05-20-2006, 03:31 AM   #46
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Seriously? I gotta try that, reminds me of Metal Gear Solid, with the boxes, lol!
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Old 05-20-2006, 04:07 AM   #47
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The AI did seem to stall a few times, but other than that I didn't see any problems with it. They died too quickly to tell if there was any group coordination or anything.

Which may have been the point, unless you were an awful player, you wouldn't usually be able to tell anyway.
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Old 03-17-2007, 06:37 PM   #48
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Default Re: Not worth to buy ?

Quote:
Originally Posted by MeatPuppet View Post
You think a small independent studio that is self funding the project can do this?
last time I checked, we didn't expect you to have a 'life' or passable 'health inssurance' or 'minimum wage' or an 'office building'. We expected you to make an episodic video game in a timely fasion. so maybe you should stop thinking about what you need to live in a first world nation and start thinking about the customer.

and if your offended by this realisation you may need to start thinking about sarcasm as well.
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Old 03-17-2007, 10:09 PM   #49
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Nice ****ing Bump

--------------------
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Old 03-18-2007, 01:48 AM   #50
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Default Re: Not worth to buy ?

Have some simpatie man. Don't you know what happened to Ritual? This type of ranting, doesn't help them out.

And yeah... BUMP of the year
________
K1200GT

Last edited by Senast : 04-06-2011 at 09:05 PM.
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