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Old 04-20-2005, 07:21 PM   #1
Michael_Russell
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Default What Not To Do...

First off, I want to thank those of you who have been replying to these threads. We are taking your feedback to heart, and applying it (where necessary and appropriate) to our current designs. About once a week, I'll be posting questions like this here so we can further refine our titles.

Now for the next question in our never-ending quest for gaming nirvana. If you could point to three things in any former Ritual title that you totally disliked and never wanted us to do anything like that again, what would they be?

It could be a level, like the stationary turret level in "Elite Force II." It could be a feature, like looting bodies in "SiN." It could be a character, a weapon, a texture...anything.

We want our games to blow your socks off, and we thank you in advance for your feedback.
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Old 04-20-2005, 07:41 PM   #2
badman
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Default Re: What Not To Do...

[*] FAKK2's cliffhanger ending (sorry, Tom ;D). I don't think I need to explain this one.[*] FAKK2's mosquitos. Never, never EVER want to see small, fast-moving bugs / mosquitos / frogs / whatever in any game ever again.[*] EF2's spider level. Why does it always have to be giant spiders topped off with a giant spider boss? $creativity-- [img]/forums/images/graemlins/frown.gif[/img]

Free bonus item: Thrallballs in SinCTF. If you're gonna add a super-powerful secondary fire option to the rocket launcher, at least balance it so people won't spam the shit out of you with it.
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Old 04-20-2005, 07:49 PM   #3
7o'nine
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Default Re: What Not To Do...

In EF2 I was a bit disappointed that my teammates didn't really play a bigger role. I think they could have been integrated a little more with the player.
I guess you guys kinda knew this (Korban makes a joke in the swamp level about Munro always going off alone). But it really did get annoying when at every problem something always happened such that the entire team is left behind while Munro scouts up ahead.
The times that you were fighting alongside them, they really weren't any use (one particular moment that I remember is outside the Attrexian colony when the two exo's fall from the sky on the bridge.. my teammates are firing at them but they're not dying! It took me like 2 shots to kill them so why do my team seem so incapable at causing damage?)
The team was definitely pretty stereotypical in the sense of having a medic, tech, demo.. etc. Yet none of their skills were really used to influence the gameplay.

I thought the branch dialog system, while pretty interesting, felt like an evil teaser [img]/forums/images/graemlins/wink.gif[/img] I know that it's hard for devs to do alternate storylines or whatever, but instead the dialogs were mostly used for trivial things (I know that with Krindo you had to give the 'right' answer otherwise Game Over, but that situation there was only one answer anyway.. so it just meant going back to the last save and try again. It didn't really affect anything later on).

[edit]
Another thing (which is more of a tech/engine related thing) is that when you listen in to other people's conversation (for example, the cadets at the Academy) you could still hear their voices quite clearly even if you steppd away from them, and this got annoying because if you somehow started another conversation, the two sets of voices played over each other making it hard to understand. It would have been nicer if the sound was completely stopped rather than fade over a (rather large) distance.
[/edit]

7
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Old 04-20-2005, 08:03 PM   #4
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Default Re: What Not To Do...

1. In Condition Zero (Deleted Scenes) I didnt like the graphics very much but I dont know if this was Rituals fault or not.

2. In Condition Zero (Deleted Scenes) the levels were all very linear. I would like to see a game with multiple paths and such (ala Splinter Cell Chaos Theory)

3. In Condition Zero (Deleted Scenes) I didnt like how some of the levels played out. For instance when there would be a scripted firefight there was very little cover.

Hope this helps! [img]/forums/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img]
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Old 04-20-2005, 08:36 PM   #5
STATIC3D
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Default Re: What Not To Do...

1) Blair Witch game...Not SiN 2.
2) FAKK 2 game...Not SiN 2.
3) EF II...Not SiN 2.
Hehe...sorry, couldn't pass this one up.

Seriously thou...
I agree on the thrall ball in SiN CTF. That thing was a monster spam weapon. Even thou I didn't play much CTF I could see that. I also know some ppl didn't like the Sniper Rifle "hit anywhere for a kill" power either.

Okay, now for my own...
I'm gonna stick to SiN seeing as it's the Ritual game I have the most experience (and time) with.
1) Lack of silent weapons (other than the Sniper Rifle). Okay, the spear gun was sort of silent. Anywho, the ability to take a guy out and not have his buddies hear it is a real nice touch. Now, we all know the SiN AI had the "oh my buddy just dropped, let's go stand RIGHT where he was when he had a hole blown in his head" aspect at times. But, excluding that, having the ability to take a guy out with something other than a sniper rifle (which was silenced) would have been nice. I don't care if it's a "get close and personal" garrot (sp?) type weapon or a silenced gun. Just something that works for closer combat situations other than the Sniper Rifle that is silent. Even a good neck breaking move would be nice...hint, hint.

2) Functional spaces. Okay, while most of the spaces in SiN were designed to feel like they "worked" (or were worked in), many games fail to make spaces that are anything more than level/puzzles for a game. Sure, it's nice to figure out the trick/maze/etc., but, I want that extra level of detail that helps the suspension of disbelief when playing. I wanna feel like I am where I AM and playing IN that environment.

3) Backtracking. While there was not much of it in SiN, to me, this is essentially a cardinal sin of many modern games to increase the "gameplay" time. If there is a real "need" for it in a game, then it can be okay. But, it's usually not used for any other purpose than to make a player retrace steps they have taken (usually with enemies now in areas they previously cleared out...ugh) in order to activate switch B so they can do something with panel A. I mean, why the H3LL don't these evil geniuses hire some designers that don't require this type of thing in their labs and lairs o doom? :}

Honorable Mention:
4) ANY and ALL platformer style jumping puzzles in FPS games SUCK! Sorry, but it has to be said. There is just something dated, and lame, about em. Tactics should be the key to gameplay, not hopping around like a bunny (which usually leads to a death via a "missed" step or being knocked off by some cheap AI "vantage" to take pot shots at you).
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Old 04-20-2005, 09:18 PM   #6
Xenogenetic
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Default Re: What Not To Do...

You should have put a n00b filter on CSX and I just plain don't like Star Trek games. Other then that I can only complain about your latest game, it wasnt SiN2
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Old 04-20-2005, 10:29 PM   #7
BrushBaron
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Default Re: What Not To Do...

funny you mention the neck breaking... i just finished chronicles of riddick and it's up close combat is awesome, including neck breaking.
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Old 04-21-2005, 12:09 AM   #8
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Default Re: What Not To Do...

This will only deal with EF2 and FAKK2.

1) Oh no! Julies sister has been kidnapped! What shall we do!?

*End of Game*

FAKK2 seemed like an unfinished story/game to me.

2) AI of EF2, including the Gung-Ho nature of Munro as expressed by Seven.

3) Lack of modability for EF2, I believe this is why the game died before its time (along with the MP as a main downfall).
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Old 04-21-2005, 02:14 AM   #9
ran93r
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Default Re: What Not To Do...

I have hardly any complaints about Ritual game features so :

This is a comment about games in general really.
I do not ever want to play another "on-rails" vehicle level, where somebody is driving and you are stuck on the back/side/whatever just shooting at random passers by. I can think of nothing more tedious.
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Old 04-21-2005, 12:38 PM   #10
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Default Re: What Not To Do...

Unfortunately Iíve only had the chance to play EF2 (did play the FAKK and SIN demos, but still havenít had the chance to play the games) so this list is geared for EF2 only.

1.) FPS bosses.

2.) Crappy multiplayer support - I know it may not have been totally in Ritualís hands, but it still reflects poorly on the developer. Even if you had pushed to have the MP contracted to independent developer(s) (like many companies now do) I think it would have been far more successful. The best developers have huge MP followings so we know itís important - or should be.

3.) The combinations of arcade/realistic shooter - just didnít work. If EF2 had been pushed all the way to a realistic shooter it would have kicked much more ass, or even if it had stayed arcade like EF or RTCW.

Not quite as important, but still worth mentioning: Anything that went outside the limits of the engine - the heavy emphasis on cut-scenes should have translated into more time on animations and voice-overs - as it was... for that matter I think Bink videos would have worked better. Also as I mentioned in the other thread the texture of the Captain's log on the Dallas' bridge was sub-par. Things like that aren't big, but they don't add to the immersion either. Some of the secondary weapon abilities seemed odd as well - I don't think they really fit, or added to the game. With all the weapons it wasn't necessary to have secondary fire on every weapon because pretty much all the bases were covered. Having 'iron sights' on some of the weapons would have been better/nice.

Iíll also agree with Tempest - better mod support would be nice. This is one of the reasons I respect developers like Bioware and Epic: they seem to go out of there way to make it easy for people to mod there games (probably because it also makes it easy to develop them, but anywayÖ). Not only does it pay off for them - some mods being as popular as they are - but it allows us to have our fun without pulling out our hair...
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Old 04-22-2005, 02:01 AM   #11
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Default Re: What Not To Do...

Quote:
Originally posted by m3rl1n:
3.) The combinations of arcade/realistic shooter - just didnít work. If EF2 had been pushed all the way to a realistic shooter it would have kicked much more ass, or even if it had stayed arcade like EF or RTCW.

Not quite as important, but still worth mentioning: Anything that went outside the limits of the engine - the heavy emphasis on cut-scenes should have translated into more time on animations and voice-overs - as it was... for that matter I think Bink videos would have worked better. Also as I mentioned in the other thread the texture of the Captain's log on the Dallas' bridge was sub-par. Things like that aren't big, but they don't add to the immersion either. Some of the secondary weapon abilities seemed odd as well - I don't think they really fit, or added to the game. With all the weapons it wasn't necessary to have secondary fire on every weapon because pretty much all the bases were covered. Having 'iron sights' on some of the weapons would have been better/nice.
About the Bink videos, i was let down after finding out i couldnt use .roq videos as textures like in other Quake3 engine based games. My little dream of making a spoof advert section integrated into a map/mod died. [img]/forums/images/graemlins/frown.gif[/img]
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Old 04-23-2005, 12:21 AM   #12
MeatPuppet
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Default Re: What Not To Do...

The weapon selection screen/system that was in FAKK2 . I never want to see something that awkward to use again.
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Old 04-23-2005, 02:54 PM   #13
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Default Re: What Not To Do...

Quote:
Originally posted by MeatPuppet:
The weapon selection screen/system that was in FAKK2 . I never want to see something that awkward to use again.

Ahh, Yes that.

*shakes and convulses at the thought!*
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Old 04-23-2005, 03:38 PM   #14
JimmyC
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Default Re: What Not To Do...

I can only think of two things off-hand.

- Not including different Skill Levels for the games as you did in FAKK 2. If the game is hard it's frustrating as hell for players who aren't very good and if it's set too easy it isn't challenging to more experienced players.

- Levels that don't give you a clear direction where to go or what to do next. The underwater levels in Sin come to mind here. While those levels look great, I either spend a lot of time going in circles or I enter a no-clip cheat and bypass the level completely.
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