Ritualistic Forums

Go Back   Ritualistic Forums > Ritual Entertainment Games > SiN Episodes > SiN Episodes: Emergence

Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
Old 05-16-2006, 03:10 PM   #1
old_sin_player
Newbie
 
Join Date: May 2006
Posts: 3
Default Not worth to buy ?

Hi all,

sorry for my bad english.
I cant belive 3 hours of gaming for a brand new game?
What said the advertising about good ai , new weaps never seen before?
Yes i put the sliders full at the right side, and only what happens is that the enemys come in masses, hurts bit more, but noone ist intelligent.
Nothing new in part 1 , and now we are at the pricing, it cant be, that you want money for each part that comes out.
If the other parts are so short you can sell all parts for the price for one.
Im very angry about this game, i liked Sin in the past, but the new Sin title is only another poor FPS.
The AI is very simple, nothing what can be called real AI , or intelligence.
Three standard weaps with only one sec firemode, i thinked till close to the poor rooftop-end "that cant be".
I read somewhere "fun is first , then GFX" , woot , where was the fun in this Game ? , only the Jetpack-soldiers were funny.
Leveldesign is good, but to linear, clear path only one solution.
Poor,poor game.
I never buy another of the parts, if it costs more than an dollar.
Only to make profit.
This taked so long to finish that game and push it to gold?
Its not fair to grab my money for a game that is only a part of a game.
old_sin_player is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-16-2006, 03:19 PM   #2
ertertwert
Fanboy
 
ertertwert's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: CA
Posts: 889
Send a message via AIM to ertertwert
Default Re: Not worth to buy ?

First of all, wrong forum. Second, when you said:
Quote:
Its not fair to grab my money for a game that is only a part of a game.
It's obvious that you didn't know this game is EPISODIC. Also, how is it not fair to sell it in parts at a LOWER price? It's not like they are charging 50+ dollars for "parts." That would be unfair.
ertertwert is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-16-2006, 04:07 PM   #3
old_sin_player
Newbie
 
Join Date: May 2006
Posts: 3
Default Re: Not worth to buy ?

Episodic, sure,
but if its episodic and you sell the parts each for more than 9 dollars than its not fair
old_sin_player is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-16-2006, 04:22 PM   #4
ertertwert
Fanboy
 
ertertwert's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: CA
Posts: 889
Send a message via AIM to ertertwert
Default Re: Not worth to buy ?

Wait. More than 9 dollars? But you just said you wouldn't buy it if it was more than one dollar...
Quote:
I never buy another of the parts, if it costs more than an dollar.
ertertwert is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-16-2006, 04:36 PM   #5
Standoff
Veteran
 
Join Date: Apr 2006
Posts: 377
Default Re: Not worth to buy ?

I don't think I've ever seen a game that made everyone happy.

I don't think I've ever seen a new concept that made everyone happy either, come to think of it.
Standoff is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-16-2006, 04:38 PM   #6
junkiiii
Newbie
 
Join Date: May 2006
Posts: 8
Default Re: Not worth to buy ?

I am not saying that I fully agree with this gentleman but, I do want to say that while I like the game because I enjoy the cinematic feel of the game and I like simple FPS's, I believe that he and a lot of others have a point.
$20.00 is a lot to pay for episodec content that is so short. No one knew how long this episode was going to be but you have to admit, it didn't have $20 worth of content.
If there are 9 episodes released like planned at $20.00 a pop you're talking $180.00 for a full game that normally costs $50.

Who here wants to pay that much for a game? No one.

I thouroughly enjoyed EP1 but I will wait to see if I want to purcahse any future episodes depending on the amount of content they put in.
junkiiii is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-16-2006, 04:43 PM   #7
Standoff
Veteran
 
Join Date: Apr 2006
Posts: 377
Default Re: Not worth to buy ?

And at $180 you're getting three or more games worth of content.

Would you have bought a sequel or two if this were a normal game?
Standoff is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-16-2006, 05:02 PM   #8
old_sin_player
Newbie
 
Join Date: May 2006
Posts: 3
Default Re: Not worth to buy ?

The game is good playable, no lags , only one "bug" at lab level (reset my skills with console command to go further).
If this is a new concept, then i dont like it.
If the Serie has seven Parts 1-7 and each costs 9 (Dollars) then would be that the maximum to pay to get all parts.
Thats 63 Dollars 3x 7 hours of gameplay and we are in an area that i can accept.
Where is the superb AI and the new weapons never seen before?
The guys act so simple it can be..
The Game isnt interactiver then others .
old_sin_player is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-16-2006, 07:18 PM   #9
Standoff
Veteran
 
Join Date: Apr 2006
Posts: 377
Default Re: Not worth to buy ?

Yeah but your 63 dollars would only make sense if you were getting the same amount of content as one game.

As it is two episodes is about the amount of content for one game, and thats $40. $40 instead of $50 seems alright to me.

Still, I'm not trying to convert you or anything. There's no chance of them going below $15, and myself I doubt they'll change from the $20 mark. It's a solid price point that most people can afford.
Standoff is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-16-2006, 07:26 PM   #10
Zinfacter
Regular
 
Zinfacter's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2006
Location: Harrisburg, PA
Posts: 72
Default Re: Not worth to buy ?

Yea, I don't really see the problem with 20 dollars.
Zinfacter is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-16-2006, 08:06 PM   #11
WretchedSpawn
Regular
 
WretchedSpawn's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2006
Location: Olympia, WA
Posts: 51
Default Re: Not worth to buy ?

Quote:
Originally posted by Standoff:
Yeah but your 63 dollars would only make sense if you were getting the same amount of content as one game.

As it is two episodes is about the amount of content for one game, and thats $40. $40 instead of $50 seems alright to me.

Still, I'm not trying to convert you or anything. There's no chance of them going below $15, and myself I doubt they'll change from the $20 mark. It's a solid price point that most people can afford.
2 episodes = 1 game? I'm sorry but no. Much as I've enjoyed Emergence thus far, the fact remains that it doesn't provide just a whole lot of play time the first time through and if the next Episode is roughly the same length and Ritual tried to sell them together as "one game" it would certainly go on record as being one of the, if not the, shortest single player FPS' ever released.

The fact of the matter is that even the highest quality products need a certain minimum amount of quantity if they're going to be selling for $50. And while there will certainly be a small percentage of gamers who are perfectly happy paying large sums of money for quality-over-quantity, I think that a lot of people would feel like they'd been ripped off and they would all come to these forums like this fellow did and bitch about the pricing. Saying that the game was good, but it still wasn't quite worth $50. $35 definitely, but sure as hell not $50.

That said, based on my own experiences and what people have been saying in the forums, 3 Episodes the length of Emergence would probably fit the vast majority of gamer's definition of "one game's worth of content." With that in mind, $60+ is kinda steep, not wholly unreasonable, but still kinda steep. I think Ritual's going to be treading a very fine line throughout the series' development cycle if they choose to leave the pricing as it is. If the quality increases exponentially as I think we are all hoping it will, the price will probably cease to be much of an issue. If, however, there are a few not so stellar Episodes, well then $ > quality and Ritual's in trouble. Yay Episodic content! No pressure Ritual! [img]/forums/images/graemlins/grin.gif[/img]
WretchedSpawn is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-16-2006, 08:22 PM   #12
Fluke
Rookie
 
Fluke's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2006
Posts: 14
Default Re: Not worth to buy ?

First off, i want to express my gratitude for someone else stepping up to the plate. Totally agree with 'old_sin_player'. I am exactly in the same opinion. But at the same time I have my own opinions and I am not trashing anyone just giving my experience and opinion based on your feedback to old_sin_player. Some of which I found not too accurate.


Quote:
ertertwert

It's obvious that you didn't know this game is EPISODIC. Also, how is it not fair to sell it in parts at a LOWER price? It's not like they are charging 50+ dollars for "parts." That would be unfair.
$20 for 3.5 hours is a rip off to me. I wasn't very happy at the fact they only came out with the game time, after release, when people started acquiring it. How many would have bought it knowing it was 5 hours at best? It was even stated on a site that they 'joked around playing and it took about 5 hours'...Joking around means excess time to play it. It took me 3.5 hours and not only that I lost part of what I earned in my first attempt because a bug also prevented me from moving ahead forcing me to reset part of my game. Hell I thought that was it right then. I wasn't initially impressed with the graphics, they looked better in the magazine.



Quote:
junkiiii

I believe that he and a lot of others have a point.
$20.00 is a lot to pay for episodec content that is so short. No one knew how long this episode was going to be but you have to admit, it didn't have $20 worth of content.
Totally agree. It didn't. It had no substance and literally no premise of a story, zero character buildups or anything, 5 mins u were gunning people left and right take on a big guy boom it's over. I mean jeez, gimme a 15 min video at the end or something..I thought the HL2 redone Rejuv boxes were acceptable in terms of originality but otherwise not much. I am pretty honestly devasted that a game I once loved is nothing much more except a money hole. I do hope they will release the entire game on 1 dvd. I'm personally not interested in paying a lot for bits and pieces of code that also didn't get really inspected well. LOTS of people had the problem, how could they not. I tried that part at least 10 times based on threads all around and on here <moved around> and I could not get past it. Different res, different settings, different driver...I give up. But I reset my stats and continued on.


Now I'm not harping on you Standoff but you "are" spreading misinformation and or forcing your view of it as being the real thing. So...

Quote:
Standoff

And at $180 you're getting three or more games worth of content.
Oh really? Spreading misinformation also one of your talents? Not every fps game was 10-15 hrs some were more, a lot more. I guess you just make 3 = 1 to you. I'd prefer to hear 3 games worth of content from 'Ritual' thanks. At $180 it's a ripoff plain and simple. If you like to pay 20 a shot for what you already seen, that's your choice. It's enough we have nVidia and ATI milking people and now some gimmick physics card we have people milking games and try to maximize their profits.


Quote:
Standoff

As it is two episodes is about the amount of content for one game, and thats $40. $40 instead of $50 seems alright to me.
Hahaha you changed your math?? 2 episodes now = 1 game? Interesting, you just change it around when needed to make it sound more attractive.. It's more like $60 worth of episodes puchases > 1 x $49 game. And by the way I beat the game in 3.5 hours without difficulty. I only died 6 times and it was only cuz I got shot through walls and steel. Oh wait, I also got frozen at in the lab. Everyone I know from work to casual friends experienced the same bug. then to top it off the solution is to reset our stats. Wow, does that come free with the $20 for 3.5 hours of play<sic>? Not everyone cares to play the game at 'top' bot skills. Maybe that's your choice, but I'm not one of them and I played around the middle settings and died a few times. And come on, Dynamic AI? I mean it's not like they are rolling around, the aimbot skill is just upped and in my opinion Dynamic AI was just flooding the game with more enemy. I've upped it to max. We are all different we all have our own view but I'm not forcing mine, I just want it to be heard. So I finished it in 1 night and I only have 4 hours total a night to play. So NO, 2 episodes are not 1 game.. try again. Sorry to blab. Just hoping you get my points.


To Ritual

Next time you release an Episode that you could do us the privilege of revealing the estimated the duration of play time will be. How many parents would allow their kid to buy a game "knowing" there was an estimated 5 hours of game play?? some kids know a lot, others like to make people believe they do. I know a few parents who's kids are into HL2 and they told me they werent impressed knowing they paid over $20 for 5 hours of play. It says nowhere on your site of the play time. I'd also like to know as well, your expected future price schedule for the Episodes. I would also appreciate it if you can tell me if this game will be released in full version on DVD. I'd also like to know as well, your expected future price schedule for the Episodes. I have heard rumors that $19.99 is not the end all say all of this game, but I have also heard that 19.99 is going to be a 'medium' price for your Episodes, could be higher, could be lower. Can you confirm or deny that?

If not, I thank you for the past memories but your game just doesn't suit my interests. I guess I leave the world of Sin to those with more money and tolerance. Ha! Like you care. ChChing!


Fluke is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-16-2006, 10:45 PM   #13
MeatPuppet
Level Designer
 
Join Date: May 2004
Posts: 123
Default Re: Not worth to buy ?

Why don't you try the game again tomorrow after the patch is released? It might be a better experience for you. The DX7 crash bug should be fixed.

As for guesstimating play time, I think they did a good job. On the Steampowered forums most folks say it took them 5 hours or so get through it. Hell it took me closer to seven because it was so damn hard.
MeatPuppet is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-16-2006, 11:57 PM   #14
PunchPudding
Rookie
 
PunchPudding's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2005
Posts: 14
Default Re: Not worth to buy ?

Quote:

...I am begining to regret buying this game, It has been a nightmare since day one and I thought it would all be worth it - I have heard (or found out for myself) so far:
The story is shit
The ending is shit
The loading times are shit
The geo detailing is above average but not revolutionary
The Interaction (sans physics) is shit (dead ends/doors)

The path is linear with a couple of "cooL" set pieces per problem that show of the physics - all the time being forced from loaded section to next loaded section without a real feeling of freedom to even explore a little
[skip ahead]
The Camera is completely wrong - feels more like a flight sim the way it cleanely glides as you walk (no bob)

The "story" parts (such as the bit where you get your suit) are painfully dull and have no sense of the magic in the original

The propoganda on all the screens is extremely irritating (maybe the point) but audio clashing is not good - when you get a headache from characters talking over that stuff.

The HUD is as dull and workmanlike as dishwater.

The textures range from gritty realism to almost cartoon quality (the first town scene - the orange houses look like a completely different style to the white houses - yet the designers get praised to high heaven about it???)

Then there are the Audio/Caching problems which are extremely widespread

I just people would get their minds in order and be realistic about this overhype product - without the stuttering problem I would give it maybe an 8/10 inline with similar products released.

[skip ahead]

I did before the release - I was 100% convinced this would be the best game ever, or at least up there with the best .. it is far from it.

Here is an example of some of the many things said about HL2 when it came out to praise from critics, gamers, and workers in the industry (winning multiple game of the year awards). You can find the same for probably every game you play be it Doom3, Far Cry, Halo, whatever. There is always someone who will look for the worst in the game and develop an emotional dislike for it... and these smart, well educated people will get on the internet and make sure they get heard.
PunchPudding is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-17-2006, 01:45 AM   #15
Gabbo
Newbie
 
Join Date: May 2006
Posts: 8
Default Re: Not worth to buy ?

Quote:

Here is an example of some of the many things said about HL2 when it came out to praise from critics, gamers, and workers in the industry (winning multiple game of the year awards). You can find the same for probably every game you play be it Doom3, Far Cry, Halo, whatever. There is always someone who will look for the worst in the game and develop an emotional dislike for it... and these smart, well educated people will get on the internet and make sure they get heard.
That, yes is a rather bad argument. He's attacking the engine the game is based on as much as the game itself.

My problems were braindead AI, and game length and price.
I know Ritual can do much better than this, I've played Ritual games before (im going back through EF2 as it is), and Emergence just didn't hold up, episodic or not.

The AI was absolutely moronic. 'See Blade', 'run up to Blade', 'Shoot at Blade with deadly accuracy despite distance and weapon type being small caliber sidearm', 'wander around predetermined paths until Blade arrives, often not noticing Blade until he's put a bullet (in most cases, multiple) into them'.

Now if this was one enemy, it would be okay, but every single enemy did this. When any enemy runs into the flames from a grenade I've thrown, and stands there burning, we have problems.


Then there's the pricing. If the episodes were 7-8 hours in gameplay length and $10, i could see me getting the rest. But until I see the fixed AI and a lower price for more game tme, I'll wait and hope for an averaged price hardcopy on storeshelves in a year.
Gabbo is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-17-2006, 02:35 AM   #16
ertertwert
Fanboy
 
ertertwert's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: CA
Posts: 889
Send a message via AIM to ertertwert
Default Re: Not worth to buy ?

Quote:
Originally posted by Fluke:How many would have bought it knowing it was 5 hours at best?
Uh, all of us? It has been stated as 4-6 hours of gameplay for many many months now. If you went going into the game not knowing that, then you pretty much just buy whatever comes out on steam without reading up on it.
ertertwert is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-17-2006, 02:39 AM   #17
nba1341
Casual
 
Join Date: Apr 2006
Posts: 26
Default Re: Not worth to buy ?

I'll agree on the AI part. They tend to just stand in front of you or just run into walls a lot.

But HL2: EP 1 AI is supposed to be improved so mabe EP 2 of Sin will use it. At least the alex following gordon around is suppose to be a lot better.
nba1341 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-17-2006, 02:55 AM   #18
ertertwert
Fanboy
 
ertertwert's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: CA
Posts: 889
Send a message via AIM to ertertwert
Default Re: Not worth to buy ?

I'll believe it when I see it.
ertertwert is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-17-2006, 03:00 AM   #19
CommanderZx2
Fanboy
 
Join Date: Oct 2005
Location: Somewhere cold
Posts: 542
Default Re: Not worth to buy ?

It'll take most of you quite a while to get used to this episode format of receiving parts of games for money, but as much as some of you don't like it it's not going to go away.

Games that are already using it: Oblivion, Battlefield 2, Half-Life 2, Xbox 360 games, Guild Wars Sound Tracks and more.

Oblivion are selling useless little eye candy things for example horse armour.
Battlefield 2 are selling those episodic content that add a couple of new units and maps.
Guild Wars sell sound tracks to add to your music and extra character slots.

Episodic content is only going to increase and spread everywhere, so you better get used to it. When it becomes as wide spread as I think it will, you won't be able to complain about prices anymore as you'd have no alternative.
CommanderZx2 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-17-2006, 03:05 AM   #20
Standoff
Veteran
 
Join Date: Apr 2006
Posts: 377
Default Re: Not worth to buy ?

Nowhere did I change my math or spread any misinformation. I gave the facts as I see them. Don't like my opinion? Don't listen. Easy enough.

Most FPSes I've played in the last three years only gave me about 8 to 12 hours of gameplay...the one that actually told me how long I'd been playing was about 7.5 (and I'm on the last level.)

I played SiN Emergence for over 5 hours...seemed like more towards 7 to me. I didn't have a timer. I'll definately play it again after the patch, I was on the middle of a run through again already.

I fully admit the game had its problems, as does every game I've ever played, but I definately liked what I played and felt it was worth $20. Yes, two episodes is about a full game to me. Three is probably more relevant as far as amount of content, but not amount of gameplay to me.

I called it as I saw it. If that's information manipulation to you, oh well.

Now if we want to go comparative, I stopped playing Half-Life 2 3/5 of the way through the game because I got bored. I came back to it 5 months later and finished it. I had problems keeping with FEAR also, though it didnt take me half that long to finish it. I still havent finished Splinter Cell Chaos Theory (as much to do with Ubisofts asinine lack of support than anything else, though, as I moved to XP x64.)

With episodic content you've also got a good chance of development long after the game has lost its sales presence, which is a decent added value. And with them keeping most of the profits gained through digital distribution, they certainly have a lot more development funds to do so.

So personally, I couldn't be happier with episodic content.

And now, I'm going to go do something useful.
Standoff is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-17-2006, 03:06 AM   #21
Standoff
Veteran
 
Join Date: Apr 2006
Posts: 377
Default Re: Not worth to buy ?

Quote:
Originally posted by CommanderZx2:Oblivion are selling useless little eye candy things for example horse armour.
Battlefield 2 are selling those episodic content that add a couple of new units and maps.
Guild Wars sell sound tracks to add to your music and extra character slots.

Guild Wars itself is episodic, with a $50 title every 6 or so months from here on. Micropayment enabled content just isn't the same thing.
Standoff is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-17-2006, 03:20 AM   #22
CommanderZx2
Fanboy
 
Join Date: Oct 2005
Location: Somewhere cold
Posts: 542
Default Re: Not worth to buy ?

Quote:
Originally posted by Standoff:
Quote:
Originally posted by CommanderZx2:Oblivion are selling useless little eye candy things for example horse armour.
Battlefield 2 are selling those episodic content that add a couple of new units and maps.
Guild Wars sell sound tracks to add to your music and extra character slots.

Guild Wars itself is episodic, with a $50 title every 6 or so months from here on. Micropayment enabled content just isn't the same thing.
Micropayment content is exactly the same thing as episodic.
CommanderZx2 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-17-2006, 10:26 AM   #23
Fluke
Rookie
 
Fluke's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2006
Posts: 14
Default Re: Not worth to buy ?

Quote:
Originally posted by MeatPuppet:
Why don't you try the game again tomorrow after the patch is released? It might be a better experience for you. The DX7 crash bug should be fixed.

As for guesstimating play time, I think they did a good job. On the Steampowered forums most folks say it took them 5 hours or so get through it. Hell it took me closer to seven because it was so damn hard.
I finished the game, I don't continue to replay what I have already done. As it were I restarted the game when I just exited being stuck between a forcefield and the office. So technically I already played it twice.
Fluke is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-17-2006, 10:33 AM   #24
Fluke
Rookie
 
Fluke's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2006
Posts: 14
Default Re: Not worth to buy ?

Quote:
Originally posted by ertertwert:
Quote:
Originally posted by Fluke:How many would have bought it knowing it was 5 hours at best?
Uh, all of us? It has been stated as 4-6 hours of gameplay for many many months now. If you went going into the game not knowing that, then you pretty much just buy whatever comes out on steam without reading up on it.
Please give me links to these old sites from months ago as I frequent one of the best gaming sites as it is, www.ggmania.com and didn't see anything until recently. Why wasn't the game time posted on their site in their advertisement for Episode 1? Was that too difficult or just hmm, too revealing...?

As well, it isn't 5-6 hours for a 'real' gamer, for me it was 3.5 hours. Maybe you missed that. 5-6 hours for a total n00b to fps, yeah I can believe that...false advertising and not enough advertising is the obvious reason here to push sales.

Sorry I read 1 or 2 main gaming sites, I don't scour the net and take statistics on everyones 'claims' to the length of the game.
Fluke is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-17-2006, 12:13 PM   #25
Standoff
Veteran
 
Join Date: Apr 2006
Posts: 377
Default Re: Not worth to buy ?

You would consider a horse armor pack a gameplay or story episode? Really?
Standoff is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply


Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

vB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Forum Jump


All times are GMT -5. The time now is 03:28 PM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.6.3
Copyright ©2000 - 2018, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.